16 Replies to “This sounds very bad”

  1. Might I ask why it is quite right that the estate is not named (and shamed)? Surely it is best to get the information out there so that people can form their own judgements?

    1. Random22 – the general area is named – it’s near Newtonmore. I know that there are several estates in that general area and it may be that the bird could have been shot on one and found dead on another – and, I stress, shooting seems possible but not exactly proved in this case.

      So you might have to name quite a few, and you couldn’t shame any – as it seems from the RSPB account (which is all I know about it).

  2. I would think reading what the PM says that it is 99.9% certain Lad was shot. It might be fair enough not to publicize the estate where the bird was found if it was close to a boundary. However if the bird was say a km or so far said boundary I would name and shame without hesitation.
    We are far too reluctant to name and shame and should be far more proactive in this area. The chances are some neanderthal that works as a keeper did this and we the conservationists are yet again pussyfooting. Oh and why is this information only coming to light now for a crime that happened 5 months ago?

  3. Hi Mark

    Do you think you could obtain photos. Of course a single pellet is all it takes but this is a big bird. But I have seen similar in geese. All that said, I an intrigued by the “horizontal split” and “split” skin terminology. I have never seen splits in skin or flesh unless it is multiple pellet strikes? A single pellet if going fast enough to go through would make a clearly defined hole and have an exit tract.

    I say all this, but of course what would the alternative be. And here I have little to offer. We know natural mortality of buzzards and sparrowhawk juveniles is very high, including from being killed by other raptors. Could a raptor talon have done this injury to the neck? Perhaps not likely.

    T

  4. “The skin was split open on the left side of the neck parallel with the jugular groove. There was haemorrhage in the subcutaneous tissues in this area and a horizontal split in the trachea. There was damage to three feathers of the right wing consisting of a single groove mark perpendicular to the shaft of each feather.”

    “Despite the failure to identify metallic fragments within the carcase the appearance of the damage to the wing feathers is consistent with damage caused by shooting. The injury to the neck could be explained by a shot gun pellet passing straight through the soft tissue of the neck. Both injuries could have brought the bird down and proved fatal.”

    Sounds like a cloud of shotgun pellets to me.

  5. The Ralia estate is two miles from Newtonmore;

    “Ralia Estate is a traditionally run family estate located in the stunning Cairngorm National Park on the banks of the famous River Spey.

    The estate runs to 23,000 acres and offers a diverse range of quality shooting from driven grouse, pheasants and partridges to duck flighting, red deer stalking and shooting over pointers.”

    http://raliaestate.com/

    The River Spey loops around Newtonmore.

    1. Mark – yes, but there are many others, see the raptorpersecutionscotland blog – they aren’t backward in coming forward and have been very circumspect on this subject.

  6. It is a fair point that birds don’t necessarily die where they have been shot or poisoned. However, reading the wide ranging accounts of persecution on this blog over the last couple of weeks – especially the North Wales deaths – it does interest me how the police, who at one point are tipping the media off so they can be there when they raid people’s houses, at another seem so coy about saying anything – even, for example, what poison has been found. I can’t remember a single instance of them saying ‘we found some drugs but we’re not telling you what they are’ – can you ? So, one can reasonably speculate, what is so different about raptor persecution ?

  7. As Mark quite rightly proved any bird shot would carry traces of lead shot in the body wonder what could have killed it.

  8. Perhaps the bird was shot with a rifle rather than a shotgun?
    A .22 rimfire’s bullet could pass through the flesh without leaving traces of metal.
    The bullet could’ve passed through the neck and grazed the feathers on exit.
    I’ve signed the petition.

  9. Andy all .22 rifle bullets are lead and expanding designed to do massive damage.

    A young Hen Harrier flying into another BOP territory is going to be attacked, peregrines attack HH on a regular basis and strike point is the neck area without stretched sharp talons. Just as likely to cause the exact same injury with no metal trace!

    Also a failed hunt could see it strike a sharp upright of twig or similar!

  11. Raptor Persecution is a blight on our countryside, however, the latest incident leaves a few unanswered questions. I don’t want to sound like a defence lawyer, but there are quite a few questions I would ask if it was a court case. We are a blame culture. Some organisations do not accept the laws of nature, and are always looking for an individual or industry to blame.

    Why was it allegedly stated after the post mortem that the Hen Harrier “may have been shot” ? Surely there would have been traces of lead ?

    Was any other cause of death considered ? If not, why not ?

    Have the vets that carried out the post mortem ever examined the victim of a raptor strike ? The likelihood is they have not.

    Were the injuries inflicted attributable to shooting only ? (Allegedly parallel wounds on the victim) Probably didn’t consider anything else.

    Could the injuries have been inflicted by a raptor such as a Peregrine ? Most likely. Defending the territory.

    Could the feather damage have been inflicted post mortem ? More than lilely as the victim was on the ground for a while before recovery.

    Why, if the victim was recorded as missing in September, has the case only come to light now ? Mmmm, a strange one. Possible that the news was released to coincide with other bad press regarding shooting at the moment. Sorry your honour, I’ll withdraw that remark, wink emoticon

    Was there not a similar case recently where a satellite tagged Golden Eagle went missing, alleged to have been persecuted,

  12. Agree with Mark here..as someone who had to make the naming decision many times in my early career, I would only ever push for that if cause of death was incontrovertible. The criminals who do kill our raptors are always very quick to point out any flaws and use their expensive lawyers to back them up…but when there is an obvious criminal killing such as shooting or poisoning [and poisoned birds do not travel long distances before dying, Ive seen enough to know] then estates should always be named. The public should know where there are dangerous criminals at work…and as I repeatedly pointed out [not always in heavy irony!] the landowners should be grateful when crimes are revealed..which of course they knew nothing about….

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