It’s a matter of head and heart isn’t it?
I am not terribly tribal in my politics. I have been too pragmatic in my life to believe that one side has all the good guys, all the wisdom and all the solutions. That can’t possibly be the case, can it?
There are plenty of politicians of other political parties whom I admire, and actually, at the moment, rather few Labour politicians I admire. If challenged to name the members of other parties whom I ‘like’ (a rather lame term) and admire then I would include Norman Lamb, Vince Cable and Norman Baker. Of the Tories there are Ken Clarke, Theresa May (for character rather than policies) and Zac Goldsmith. And then there is the incomparable Caroline Lucas of the Greens.
I would much rather the two free-thinking, environmentally-expert MPs, Caroline Lucas and Zac Goldsmith , were re-elected than that they were replaced with non-environmental Labour MPs. We need every pro-environment MP in the House of Commons that we can get.
But I was reminded when driving through Yorkshire on Sunday morning, listening to Desert Island Discs on the car radio, when Theresa May was on (and I do admire her) that I could never be a Conservative when she said that she was a Tory because decisions are better made by the individual than by the government. I don’t really believe that. It is often true, but I don’t want to believe it. What I want to believe, and do believe, is what is written on the back of my Labour Party membership card, in red letters, that ‘ by the strength of our common endeavour we achieve more than we achieve alone‘.
Labour is the party of cooperation, internationalism, fairness and compassion, as far as I am concerned.
But Labour is rarely the party of the environment and very rarely the party of wildlife and rural issues. When in power, Labour often does a passable environmental job, as it did in its last go at running the country, but it rarely sounds like it is a naturally environmental party. And that’s a shame for those of us who care passionately about the environment.
Only a personal lapse by my Labour MP, Andy Sawford, could put me off voting for him and I’ll be leafletting on his behalf on the run-in to the general election, for sure.
But even for the committed, we want our chosen political party to give us something to cheer about. It’s a bit like a football supporter wants victory, but if not victory then at least that the team has played its heart out and given us something to applaud. We want a reason to believe.
Labour, at the moment, is playing a rather dull game (speaking as a supporter). Boring, boring Labour, perhaps? You appear to be taking my support for granted (and you probably can, that’s the trouble) when you ought to be giving me a reason to believe in you. That’s what you are doing wrong (and, by the way, a few wildlife NGOs are making the same mistake too).
But surely there are so many open goals into which Maria Eagle can stick a few balls, that the environmental aspects of the Labour manifesto could, surely, more or less write themselves. Here are a few examples:
promise to put in a complete network of marine protected areas – Labour started this off with the Marine Act, the ConDems have completely failed to make progress, and it’s a job that needs to be finished off- ban lead ammunition following the Quito agreement a couple of weeks ago (supported by the UK as part of the EU delegation) – and this is also unfinished business for Labour as Michael Meacher brought in the initial ban of leade ammunition for wildfowl in England
- ban driven grouse shooting – we now know that grouse moor management puts up the water bills of the many, and increases the insurance bills of the many, and worsens the climate for all, and deprives the many of the chance to see ‘protected’ wildlife and all for the profit of the few. Come on – whose side are you on?
- introduce vicarious liability for wildlife crime – it takes the pressure off the working class gamekeeper and distributes some of that pressure to the rich and powerful so they cannot avoid the consequences of crime on their land and on their behalf
- commit to reducing bovine tb in cattle by all means necessary, even killing badgers if necessary, but with the emphasis on improvements in biosecurity and through vaccination of cattle and badgers
- ensure value for money for the taxes of all when agri-environment funds are spent on rewarding the few – why does Labour always bend to the will of the NFU’s self-interest?
Have you noticed that all of the above are examples of where the government needs to make sure that the interests of the many take precedence over the profits of the few?
Those are just a few examples, of course, but they indicate the type of measure on the environment that would get me cheering again. I want to cheer. There’s a big game coming up at the end of the season and it’s a few days later than the FA Cup Final.
Surely, between the two of them, a couple of Eagles can get this right for the manifesto? Come on Maria and Angela – give us something to cheer. That’s all you need to do.
Give me a couple of environmental policies that excite me and I’ll be happy because I believe in Labour and want to put all the doubts aside.
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Well said Mark.However I find it increasingly hard to stick to my policitical allegiance just because I have always voted and believed that way. Feel Labour have really lost their way. I am leaning more towards the Greens now.
Fiona – I too am leaning to the Left, and am finding the Greens are there to give me support whereas Labour seems to have moved. but I may reconsider after the next general election, not before.
I’m also leaning towards the Green Party. I’ve been a Lib Dem voter for many years in a largely Tory constituency with an ex-banker as MP so my vote is only a protest anyway. As a University Lecturer Clegg’s U-turn on tuition fees has cost me my job so I can’t support him. Labour doesn’t ring true to me, I don’;t trust Ed Balls on the economy and I don’t trust them with the wildlife that I love and care about. Rhetoric and empty promises are all I hear from Labour. Let’s go Green!
Nigel – thank you. There is quite a theme developing here.
If you care about wildlife, the environment, as well as a whole host of social and humanitarian policies, and sustainable economics. The Greens are the only answer.
Chris – you clearly aren’t alone in that view.
Nothing at all to do with Labour but a comment on how all Govts of wherever cant seem to act as quickly as we would like
I am in India at the moment and in the area where they have a bird flu epidemic. The disease is found in the duck population and chicken farms. The govt is concentrating on the impact of migratory birds. This is on the basis that four cormorant were found dead, despite ducks being kept in very close proximity in pens and cormorants fishing between them. Even closing bird reserves to access.
Yes they are culling ducks but the big article in the local paper (English version not Sanskrit) is how the farmers association is fighting it because they are not getting paid enough. It just brought back images of the influence of certain groups elsewhere.
Bob – thank you to ‘our correspondent in India’. Enjoy your trip. Don’t snog any ducks.
Hello Mark,
An interesting piece about a dilemma facing many of us “watermelons”. I too was a card carrying Labour supporter and have “banged on” about environmental issues to anybody in the party that would listen (including all the potential leaders at the last “hustings” at Bristol) with little, if any, affect. You may have noticed the word “was” – with reluctance (like all break-ups) I have joined the truly left leaning Green Party with its core environmental values. I don’t agree with all their policies, but I odo agree with enough of them to get my time and my vote.
John
John – I can understand that, and it seems a view that is growing.
That’s the problem with contemporary politics, of all persuasions; a few policies here , a few sweeteners there. And why? To buy a few votes from a whatever group the party thinks it needs to buy votes from.
What I want to see – what I think we should all be interested in seeing – is the strategic plan for this country; a vision for where we want to steer our nation over the next 30-50 years. Businesses have long-term plans but apparently the country can be run on 5-year cycles, lurching from left to right depening on which party leader ‘looks’ more Prime Ministerial. Saving Hen Harriers, solving farmers’ bovine-TB plight and banning lead shot are admirable goals, but they do little to protect the long-term future of our environment. There will still be 6000 new houses built on green belt land near me over the next five years…it really doesn’t matter what flavour shot gun cartridge you prefer to shoot over that land; HS2 (and quite possibly 3) will still plough through ancient woodlands…even though high-speed rail, at £80bn+ is a folly in a country with such a small land area; and we’ll be fracking the length and breadth of Britain whether you vote red, blue or purple (or, apparently, yellow…though I believe most people have given up on yellow now!)…not withstanding the need to reduce greenhouse gas emissions.
We don’t need small time politicians with small ideas chasing a few transient votes. We need politicians with balls who are prepared to stand up and say “yes, the economy is important but so is the environment, and this is how we need to model our country to secure both”. If all we worry about is Hen Harriers today and badgers tomorrow then, in the long-term, we’ll lose, because short-term economic gain, when you don’t have a long-term plan, will always win in the current model.
Richard – very well said. Let’s hope it happens.
Perhaps to that list you could add restoring the sense of purpose and independence of Natural England. Parliament should determine what the law is on wildlife protection but Natural England and other relevant agencies should then enforce that law without fear or favour.
Jonathan – yes, it could be a long list.
A new organisation is needed, the old is so ‘over managed’ or emaciated that it’s sadly become part of the problem.
Independence whilst ideal is unlikely, how do you fund it? If it’s public funds then Ministers and their entourage get involved, so independence becomes ‘managed’?
I have always voted Labour, but next year I am considering going green. I am disillusioned by the lack of, well of anything from Labour on the environment and the British countryside. I have had a few conversations with my local MP Denis Skinner about my worries on wildlife and he always shares my concerns, he always replies to my emails and letters but I never get the impression that it’s a major priority. Now The Beast Of Bolsover is about as far left as you can get in the Labour party, but if he seems a little ambivalent about the subject what hope can we have in a Labour Party that has moved way over to the right?
Stewart – there are many of us feeling like you do.
I don’t think that concern for wildlife is a left-right issue to be honest and there is no reason to suppose that, as a result of being to the left of his party, Dennis Skinner should also be greener than the rest of the party. The Socialist Workers’ Party is undoubtedly to the left of Labour but a glance at their web-site does not reveal any obvious preoccupation with the state of nature.
In any scenario in which jobs for his constituents were in a trade off with protection of species or habitats I’d wager that Skinner would go for the jobs every time.
All my life I have lived in constituencies where I knew that my vote could never make a difference (for the record, yes I always have bothered to vote even so). I have always lived in places that would be Tory to the end of time, or Labour till the end of time. Elections in the UK are decided by the tiny minority of people (about 50,000 people I’m told) who both live in a constituency marginal enough for their vote to make a difference and who are the kind of people who think about how they vote and sometimes change their allegiance.
UKIP seems to be riding this wave of disillusionment much more successfully than the Greens have been able to do, sadly, and may indeed break the mould (in which case may your deity of choice help us all). But this does mean, perversely, that maybe the mainstream parties will have to pay more attention to environmental issues than in the past. Maybe we’re entering an era where they will realise that, perhaps for the first time in their political lives, every vote actually does count.
If ever there was a time to shake established politicians of all the mainstream parties out of their environmental apathy, this is that time. Let them know it’s not only the euroskeptics who’s votes they should be chasing. This time they can’t take everyone elses’ for granted either, and far more people belong to wildlife organisations than to any of the political parties. This time they need our votes; let them know that it’s time for them to step up and deserve them.
bill – thank you, I hope you are right. We will see over the next few months.
“Elections in the UK are decided by the tiny minority of people … and who are the kind of people who think about how they vote and sometimes change their allegiance.”
Sadly, they don’t necessarily think terribly hard.
Like Bill, I will vote even though in the safe seat where I live it will not make a jot of difference. I wish that when voting reform was on offer during this parliament that there had been a genuine effort to improve the system and get more people engaged in politics. It would be interesting to see how much real support UKIP and the Greens have when they are not just attracting protest votes.
I would add to your list, Mark, scrapping vanity projects like HS2 and spending the money on improving existing rail infrastructure across the whole country.
Lyn – many thanks.
I have always been a labour supporter, indeed I was a party member through most of the seventies and early eighties, when I lived in the Ladywood . I rather lost heart during the Blair years, yes they did some good things, they also did some bloody awful things including being George Bush’s poodle, it was also quite clear that Blair himself had few principles and was certainly no socialist.
Yet I’m still broadly a labour man,although here in the Tory heartland of Harrogate a frog could probably get elected if it wore a blue rosette, but then a frog leads UKIP or at least thats what he looks like.
Many labour supporters need the party to get a grip of wildlife and environmental issues the Condems don’t seem to give a damn,but are Labour listening?
I just read this timely piece in The Independent: http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/waste-your-vote-on-the-green-party–or-choose-a-green-labour-government-9883107.html
Unfortunately (if you’re a Labour supporter), Mr Khan misses a prime opportunity to make clear what Labour’s environmental policies would be. Instead he just writes an opinion piece on why a Green vote would be wasted. Poor show.
One of my favourite songwriters wrote the lyrics: “X marks the spot that gives me my voice; But how can I vote when there isn’t a choice?”. Which sums up perfectly why my original intention was to spoil my ballot paper next year in protest.
Now, however, I believe there is a real alternative. So I have joined the party and shall be voting Green in 2015.
Pete – thanks for the link to the piece in the Independent – this blog is clearly in tune with the zeitgeist. I didn’t think it was a very convincing article either.
I shall be voting Labour in 2015 – and I will remain a Labour Party member until after that election. Then it may be time to assess the alternatives.
And thanks for the link to the song too. new one for me.
I used to be a Labour party member. I have continued to vote for them with decreasing enthusiasm, despite Lisa Nandy being an excellent local MP. However, when I read Green Party policies (http://greenparty.org.uk/values/), I found that I agreed with them on far more than environmental issues. I wish Labour would steal most of the Green policies. I will have a difficult decision next May!
John Smith was almost the the last politician I respected but he’s dead. Unfortunately the present incumbent round here is not Graham Stringer – or I would vote for him. I like the cut of his jib. He gave the Green Parrot a good Klassing yesterday, at 10:23.
http://www.theyworkforyou.com/whall/?id=2014-11-25a.195.0&s=climate#g220.0
Good blog Mark, and a reflection of the thought process that so many members of the Green Party (including me) have been through in the past, over a whole range of issues, not just environmental ones. Time and again, the Labour Party comes up short in the reckoning of how closely they match people’s aspirations for a left political force in this country and so people switch. The great pity of the current reaction from Labour folk, such as Khan, is that the best way to counter the ‘threat’ that they perceive the Greens to be, would be to get back to what people expect of them, and then the steady drifting away of support would dry up in a flash.
I’m a Green, a councillor actually, so hardly unbiased you might say, but I genuinely couldn’t care less if the Greens never won a single vote again, if that was because someone else was offering the solutions that we need – environmentally, socially, economically, however you look at it. Labour’s direction of late has been the cause of the problem they are worrying about, and their arguments against voting Green only serve to reinforce the discontent felt by many former and current members.
Check out this site which shows you which party you are closest to in terms of their policy agenda. A good number of people have switched after seeing that they are in fact closer to the Greens than to Labour. On which point, I have a genuine question for you – if you think you might switch, what’s the reason for waiting till after the election?
sorry, messed up the link – can I edit it? or can you sort that for me? Cheers
Sven
sven – seems to work for me?
sven – welcome and thank you for your comment.
I have featured the Vote for Policies website on this blog before – and helped (in a tiny way) to fund it. I recommend it to others to try.
Why wait until after the general election? Well, I might never switch. I want to see the election manifestos of all the parties , and I will review them on this site when they emerge, and i wait to be pleasantly surprised by that of Labour (even though it was arguably the worst environmentally last time around).
Also, where I live, I want to support an excellent sitting Labour MP, Andy Sawford, in a marginal constituency. I will work to get him re-elected. After that, I am likely to keep voting Labour here even if I wish that we had a Green government (a point that I have not yet reached). But I can imagine giving up my Labour Party membership if they continue to disappoint across a wide range of issues.
I recently did the Political Compass test (http://www.politicalcompass.org/ukparties2010) and found it quite interesting to compare my results with those of the main political parties to see who I should be supporting. I came out as a left wing libertarian, and was in almost exactly the same position on the chart as the Green party. The next nearest option (for me) was the SNP, and those are indeed the two parties that I supported at the last Holyrood election (SNP constituency vote and Green list vote).
Due to the stupid first past the post system for Westminster, the Greens have little chance of benefiting from my vote, whereas there is a chance of the SNP defeating the Libdems (who I used to vote for up until 2010) so the SNP will get my vote. I would also like to see a big contingent of SNP MPs next May to try to ensure that we actually get the ‘Devo (Super)Max’/’closest thing to federalism’ that we were promised in September, but in the long term I think that Green is the way ahead.
The other interesting thing about the political compass chart is that Labour and the Greens are in diametrically opposite parts of the chart, so it is interesting to see comments here about people trying to choose between the two. Perhaps a lot of people still vote on the basis of what Labour used to believe in, rather than what it does now. Or perhaps Political Compass is wrong.
Paul – that is fascinating. You, me and Gandhi in the same place!
Mrs.C thought Theresa May’s choice of “Walk Like A Man” on DID was a message
Despite Labour’s environmental shortcomings, I do believe that they are far more likely to use evidence and reason in their policy-making than the Tories who seem to be guided only by self-interest. But the choice between Labour and Greens is indeed a hard one.
If you want to make room for environmental issues you need to diversify British politics away from the two party system and reform the electoral and constitutional systems which keep these two parties in power, despite their failures. That means long game voting for parties on the basis of their policies and credibility and irrespective of their immediate prospects of a majority.
British hubris and insularity mean that no attention is ever paid to other European states who run much more diverse and cooperative political systems and cultures, where a range of smaller parties have some access to power. That is illustrated, topically, by their pre election leaders debates, which feature up to 8 or 9 party leaders on stage at once. This simple exercise is apparently impossible in Britain – far too messy – wouldn’t work for the ‘Mother of Parliaments’ – so Greens and SNP are excluded.
The political will and focus needed to address even simple environmental issues like raptor persecution is never going to come from Labour or (of course) Tory, but it could emerge in time from alliances in a genuinely representative parliament. The SNP is proposing an alliance with the Greens, Plaid and others which, given the likely destruction of Labour in Scotland, could exert considerable progressive influence post May and make voting Green a very viable option.
Stevenson – good comment, thank you.
I can only echo what so many others here are saying. My constituency of Ludlow is pretty solidly Tory. I’ve always tended to be motivated to vote tactically against the Tories, and as their drift towards a more and more neoliberal right wing agenda has intensified, all the more so. Here a tactical vote means Lib Dem, and to be honest, whilst I feel the Lib Dems were naive at the beginning of the coalition, their subsequent vilification has not been entirely deserved. Nevertheless, I won’t vote for them at the 15 election, as they won’t be in a position to win our seat, so I am going to vote Green – they’re closest to what I believe in. I probably would vote Labour in a marginal like Corby, but it would be a tough call, as the current Labour party has totally failed to portray any strategic vision of a progressive future. That means addressing inequality and globalisation, taking on the vested interests which are destroying this country. Instead its gutless strategy has been to say nothing and hope the Tories lose. And maybe it’s just waking up to the fact that UKIP is the result.
John – many thanks
Interesting thought provoking blog and comments. More so for me as I have never ever perceived a competition between Greens and Labour – indeed I don’t remember even considering labour for at least 25 years. One thing this blog does show is that at least a few people are THINKING about the ramifications of their vote.
Stella – thank you
I bet I’m not alone believing you would be an excellent MP Mark. You’d wake the country up with your principles and get a lot of support. If you disagree with me, please keep re-considering until you agree and become one.
Nigel – thank you, but you’d better stick to saving Spoon-billed Sandpipers and I’ll stick to mucking about blogging, writing books and giving talks. Good to see you on Sunday – though too briefly.